Genetics , Breeding and Cross Breeding

Originally Posted by jwhtan

actually if u looked closely today, those HBRTGs are almost certainly from local farms

hehehehe.......sum from indo...

[Fire87]

Originally Posted by Mewmender

We do see the same thing in reds (orangy looking red, dark blood red colouration and so on ...) , xb, greens and not to mention 1.5 reds. parent A1 and parent A2's offspring will never be exactly the same as parent B1 and Parent B2's offspring even though they are the same species .

As long as the parents are different, no 2 different lines will look exactly simillar

not exactly. the line of distinction is more prominent in golds than reds, if we're talking about arowanas RTG and upwards. like you said the offsprings of different pairings of even pure strain spawns would give different results, how is it that the certain characteristics of certain farm's products end up looking similar to each other, yet unique to other farms? They can't be consistantly from the same parents ma... even guppies can't spawn that fast and frequently.

line is one thing, but can it be possible that all the arowanas used in the broodstock came from just one breeding pair? Thats why the f3/4/5 share a common unique characteristic? it's probably not the case, IMO.

er.....

my two cents worth,

I think when you cross a grade 1 red with a XB, you will get a range of colouration of F1
ranging from red to "TY" to gold, this is mendelian genetics,

when you cross the F1 TY with F1 TY,

you will get either red or gold (going back to the F0)

when you cross F1 TY with F0,

you get the traits of the particular F1 TY brooder that you have used (backcrossing)

when you cross F1 TY with a red(not from the F0 stock), you will get almost clean batches of TY with colouration of TY + more red traits.


as for the HBRTG,

I think farmers breed them because of a few reasons:

1. RTG are more prolific breeders in our climate and conditions
2. the "XB" used in these breeding "programs" are either "lousy" ( which might also means hybrids) XB that did not cross, or it has very light colouration, or undesirable traits(short finnage, PLJ, short head)......

Totally agree with you that it has not economical sense to breed these....BUT...different breeders have different mind set...

Originally Posted by jwhtan

why do we see some rtgs with yellow tails ? this comes back to the thread where we were talking abt how pure our aros really are ... and why do some farms always have this trait ? tat is again because of the brooding stock...

would selective breeding take a shorter time, yes and no ... effectively it takes one generation less if u subscribed to the xb/rtg theory but further to tat, no since they all take at least 4 years each generation.

not exactly. the line of distinction is more prominent in golds than reds, if we're talking about arowanas RTG and upwards. like you said the offsprings of different pairings of even pure strain spawns would give different results, how is it that the certain characteristics of certain farm's products end up looking similar to each other, yet unique to other farms? They can't be consistantly from the same parents ma... even guppies can't spawn that fast and frequently.

yes of course they do not breed constantly from the same parents? IMO no farm constantly have all their RTGs with yellowish tail, unless u have pics to prove me wrong


line is one thing, but can it be possible that all the arowanas used in the broodstock came from just one breeding pair? Thats why the f3/4/5 share a common unique characteristic? it's probably not the case, IMO


F3/4/5 could share a common characteristic due to the fact that they are inbred, and they could be backbred with the F1, so basically trying to keep the characteristics as simillar as possible .

Originally Posted by Mewmender

not exactly. the line of distinction is more prominent in golds than reds, if we're talking about arowanas RTG and upwards. like you said the offsprings of different pairings of even pure strain spawns would give different results, how is it that the certain characteristics of certain farm's products end up looking similar to each other, yet unique to other farms? They can't be consistantly from the same parents ma... even guppies can't spawn that fast and frequently.

yes of course they do not breed constantly from the same parents? IMO no farm constantly have all their RTGs with yellowish tail, unless u have pics to prove me wrong


line is one thing, but can it be possible that all the arowanas used in the broodstock came from just one breeding pair? Thats why the f3/4/5 share a common unique characteristic? it's probably not the case, IMO


F3/4/5 could share a common characteristic due to the fact that they are inbred, and they could be backbred with the F1, so basically trying to keep the characteristics as simillar as possible .

does it means that....the farm owner from 1 look they can distinguish its they farm fish a not?

[Fire87]

Originally Posted by jwhtan

why do we see some rtgs with yellow tails ? this comes back to the thread where we were talking abt how pure our aros really are ... and why do some farms always have this trait ? tat is again because of the brooding stock...

would selective breeding take a shorter time, yes and no ... effectively it takes one generation less if u subscribed to the xb/rtg theory but further to tat, no since they all take at least 4 years each generation.

so in the first place, are the brooding stock pure? if they aren't, then some form of crossbreeding would have occurred before, isn't it?

The HBRTG theory may have originated from another farm and then weaved into a fairytale, or it may have happened sometime ago, but then I do believe most of the HBRTGs in the market are not of RTGxXB descendence, but still, they may or may not be linebred with RTGxRTGs.

Originally Posted by kimkuan

does it means that....the farm owner from 1 look they can distinguish its they farm fish a not?

if possible... i think if we lost our tags from our aros can bring back to the farm they should be able to identify it hor ?

Originally Posted by Mewmender

if possible... i think if we lost our tags from our aros can bring back to the farm they should be able to identify it hor ?

dun think its possible leh....they so solid ah..
and they got import fish from other places too leh...

[jwhtan]

Originally Posted by Fire87

so in the first place, are the brooding stock pure? if they aren't, then some form of crossbreeding would have occurred before, isn't it?

The HBRTG theory may have originated from another farm and then weaved into a fairytale, or it may have happened sometime ago, but then I do believe most of the HBRTGs in the market are not of RTGxXB descendence, but still, they may or may not be linebred with RTGxRTGs.

yes some form of crossbreeding may have occurred but it is not like wat many have professed and spread it to be ... tat HBRTGs are a result of a breeding programme between Xbacks and RTGs ...

[Fire87]

Originally Posted by Mewmender

yes of course they do not breed constantly from the same parents? IMO no farm constantly have all their RTGs with yellowish tail, unless u have pics to prove me wrong

F3/4/5 could share a common characteristic due to the fact that they are inbred, and they could be backbred with the F1, so basically trying to keep the characteristics as simillar as possible .

Yup no farm will constantly have all their RTGs with yellowish tail, but it's a little observation I made over time. I may be totally incorrect, or just half correct, but some farms do throw out these fish consistantly. No? I wish I had pics from all the spawns to prove, alas it's impossible.

Agree with the second paragraph but it doesn't shed light on the threadstarter's topic. So are we trying to try to conclude if HBRTGs are pure strains or whether the HBRTGs are in fact RTGxXB descendants?