complete newbie

bentong · 09-11-2005, 02:34 AM

hi guys, i shall be starting up my first marine tank in the next month or so, inspired by the scuba diving trip i just came back from, where i saw huge pufferfish, angel fish, target fish, barracuda and even a turtle..
been urged by my frens to take the plunge for more than a yr now, but ive stuck to FW so far..
anyone got any advice? im gg out tmr to buy stuff liao.. my fren gg to give me advice..

got a 3x1.5x1.5 standard tank for this project..
dun hv any equipment or salt or anything at all..

hope to learn as much as possible here..

09-11-2005, 09:05 AM

Welcome to the empty pocket hobby , do read up some of the thread and u get the info on what equipment to get . There is a good thread by bro Deepend.(if i got the nick correct)

bentong · 09-11-2005, 01:24 PM

yeah i read that already..

09-11-2005, 04:34 PM

Hmm,first u shld decide whther u wanna keep FOWLR(fish only wif live rocks) or a complete reef.
FOWLR usually require lesser $$ than the reef as you just keep fishes.You will nid heavy filtration if u decide to keep big angels and tangs or predators like triggers,groupers or puffers.
On the other hand,a reef tank consist of inverts,corals and fish.You wld nid to get more hardware like chillers and MHs.

bentong · 09-11-2005, 07:11 PM

im tinking more on the side of having a reef..
according to my fren with the live rock and dsb and a gd protein skimmer i dun need a filter..
that will also reduce my water temp cos not so many pumps to heat it up..
maybe ill get a fan later..
no money for a chiller..

today just went out and bought sand and salt..
and died carrying it home on the mrt..
was spilling sand everywhere cos the plastic bag broke..
next time i go buy stuff im gonna bring a trolley man..

lighting wise ill prob go for the cheapest possible, PL or T5 lor..
MH is out of my budget..

now im gonna fill up my tank and begin cycling with some market prawns, does it speed things up if i add sugar?
cos im a really impatient person..
tmr gonna get some live rock to help with my filtration..

09-11-2005, 07:15 PM

wah...bro..seems like everything is going choo choo fast for u...haha...

for lightings...u can check with ben from horizon venture...

in fact..u can go www.sgreefclub.com to read up more~

and yes...not necessary to have a cannister filter if ur skimmer is gd

*wow...i can give some minor advise liao...

**KaLiB** · 09-11-2005, 07:23 PM

Is the 3x1.5x1.5 tank glass 6mm glass? If so, it maybe a little thin for a marine setup. Although it still can be use, extra caution must be taken to prevent it from leaking as due to the thinner glass it is more prone to leakages.

Although LR,DSB and a skimmer do work together to provide for the filtration needs of a setup. There are several things IMO to take note of:
- DSB
Do more research into this, it is not as simple as making a thick 4"-5" sandbed. There are pros and cons to a DSB. Furthermore, due to your tank glass thickness(If it is 6mm), a DSB would be unsuitable IMO. This is for safety reasons in case overtime the glass cannot take the weight and it starts to leak.
- LR
You need alot of LR, are you prepared to spend so much on LR? You could need around 40kg-50kg(Can set you back from anywhere from $240-$400 at least) at least. I bought at least 70kg for my 4x2x2(Can see pics in my gallery).
- Skimmer
Not just any old skimmer would do the trick. You should use a venturi skimmer at the very minimum(Weipro is a cheap choice for a start). Airpump driven skimmers are not good at skimming out dissolve organics in a 3' tank.

For a 1.5' deep tank, HO T5s would be sufficient. 4x39W should be able to provide light for a wide range of corals.

Just stick to the prawn method. I've not heard of anyone using the sugar method so i don't know if it will speed up cycling or not. Better to stick to proven methods like using LR or dead prawn to cycle the tank.

No matter how impatient you are, you must wait at least 4weeks for the tank to cycle. No matter how tempting it is, do not add any livestock(except for LR).

09-11-2005, 09:50 PM

Welcome bro bentong. Yes bro, it's better to have a tank of at least 8mm. If it's 6mm, try not to lean too much live rocks on the side glasses. And bro, my advise to you is that, try not to go into reef if you intend to use a cooling fan, I tried it before, your corals will not survive long due to PO4 and NO3 from constant topping up of tap water, but if you have a water purified system for the tap water, then it's perfectly fine. Cooling fan evaporates a hug amount of water a day, a daily top up, or the most 2 days once a topping up of water is a must.

bentong · 09-11-2005, 11:38 PM

thks for all the advice..
im not sure how thick it is, standard ocean free 3ft tank..
shld be 6mm lah, cos it was only $35 ard 2 yrs back..
but my fren has been using the same tank in with marine setup for the same period(2yrs) and things hv been fine so far..
so im just hoping for the best, will try to minimise leaning the rocks on the side..

ok i shall invest in a gd skimmer, and guess wad, i managed to dig out an old eheim 1260, so i switch that with the pumps in my 6ft tank so i hv more options..

for a 4x2x2 using 70kg, i tink i would only need ard 20-25kg, if i dun pack it too tight..
becos if u calculate by tank volume, 3x1.5x1.5 is ard 182litres, 4x2x2 is 432litres, ard 2/5 only..
and yeah i shall fork out initially, then try and minimise spending..

as for the sugar, the theory i heard is this:
during cycling, the main limiting factor is the amt of carbon the bb can obtain, not nitrogen or oxygen..
by adding sugar, we are providing extra carbon for it to use, so it can grow faster..
for example, if u were to add sugar to ur tank, there would be a bacteria bloom and the water would turn cloudy, in this case the limiting factors hv become the surface area for them to grow and oxygen, which can be increased by aeration..
so by providing maximum of every factor, can cultivate the bb faster..
or at least thats the theory, i shall try a bit tmr..
throw in prawns and sugar, and up aeration..
cant rmb hear from who one, tink its some aromedic in our forum..

without a fan, is it possible to go into corals?
if i place my lights higher or wadever?

yeah im moving fast, trying to settle everything asap, so it can be stable by the end of my hols..

btw, which place gd to buy lights?
i dunno any places to buy marine stuff, went with my fren to reborn and paradiz reef today at boon keng area..

thks for all the help guys!

10-11-2005, 11:04 AM

Do not add sugar to your system anytime in it's progress
The bacterial population is very hard to control (2x every 20min) and when you get allelopathy happening due to Quorum Sensing, you are in big trouble
Just add in the prawn and be patient.

09-11-2005, 02:34 AM	#1
bentong Dragon Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 574	complete newbie hi guys, i shall be starting up my first marine tank in the next month or so, inspired by the scuba diving trip i just came back from, where i saw huge pufferfish, angel fish, target fish, barracuda and even a turtle.. been urged by my frens to take the plunge for more than a yr now, but ive stuck to FW so far.. anyone got any advice? im gg out tmr to buy stuff liao.. my fren gg to give me advice.. got a 3x1.5x1.5 standard tank for this project.. dun hv any equipment or salt or anything at all.. hope to learn as much as possible here..

09-11-2005, 07:23 PM	#7
KaLiB Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 3,635	Is the 3x1.5x1.5 tank glass 6mm glass? If so, it maybe a little thin for a marine setup. Although it still can be use, extra caution must be taken to prevent it from leaking as due to the thinner glass it is more prone to leakages. Although LR,DSB and a skimmer do work together to provide for the filtration needs of a setup. There are several things IMO to take note of: - DSB Do more research into this, it is not as simple as making a thick 4"-5" sandbed. There are pros and cons to a DSB. Furthermore, due to your tank glass thickness(If it is 6mm), a DSB would be unsuitable IMO. This is for safety reasons in case overtime the glass cannot take the weight and it starts to leak. - LR You need alot of LR, are you prepared to spend so much on LR? You could need around 40kg-50kg(Can set you back from anywhere from $240-$400 at least) at least. I bought at least 70kg for my 4x2x2(Can see pics in my gallery). - Skimmer Not just any old skimmer would do the trick. You should use a venturi skimmer at the very minimum(Weipro is a cheap choice for a start). Airpump driven skimmers are not good at skimming out dissolve organics in a 3' tank. For a 1.5' deep tank, HO T5s would be sufficient. 4x39W should be able to provide light for a wide range of corals. Just stick to the prawn method. I've not heard of anyone using the sugar method so i don't know if it will speed up cycling or not. Better to stick to proven methods like using LR or dead prawn to cycle the tank. No matter how impatient you are, you must wait at least 4weeks for the tank to cycle. No matter how tempting it is, do not add any livestock(except for LR). __________________ A fishtank is just like your computer. When your tank crash(OS crash), its time to cleanup(reformat hard drive) and setup(install OS) again and add new livestock(re-install software).

09-11-2005, 09:05 AM	#2
monsterz1975 Guest Posts: n/a	Welcome to the empty pocket hobby , do read up some of the thread and u get the info on what equipment to get . There is a good thread by bro Deepend.(if i got the nick correct)

09-11-2005, 01:24 PM	#3
bentong Dragon Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 574	yeah i read that already..

09-11-2005, 04:34 PM	#4
veliferium Guest Posts: n/a	Hmm,first u shld decide whther u wanna keep FOWLR(fish only wif live rocks) or a complete reef. FOWLR usually require lesser $$ than the reef as you just keep fishes.You will nid heavy filtration if u decide to keep big angels and tangs or predators like triggers,groupers or puffers. On the other hand,a reef tank consist of inverts,corals and fish.You wld nid to get more hardware like chillers and MHs.

09-11-2005, 07:11 PM	#5
bentong Dragon Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 574	im tinking more on the side of having a reef.. according to my fren with the live rock and dsb and a gd protein skimmer i dun need a filter.. that will also reduce my water temp cos not so many pumps to heat it up.. maybe ill get a fan later.. no money for a chiller.. today just went out and bought sand and salt.. and died carrying it home on the mrt.. was spilling sand everywhere cos the plastic bag broke.. next time i go buy stuff im gonna bring a trolley man.. lighting wise ill prob go for the cheapest possible, PL or T5 lor.. MH is out of my budget.. now im gonna fill up my tank and begin cycling with some market prawns, does it speed things up if i add sugar? cos im a really impatient person.. tmr gonna get some live rock to help with my filtration..

09-11-2005, 07:15 PM	#6
bluezing Guest Posts: n/a	wah...bro..seems like everything is going choo choo fast for u...haha... for lightings...u can check with ben from horizon venture... in fact..u can go www.sgreefclub.com to read up more~ and yes...not necessary to have a cannister filter if ur skimmer is gd *wow...i can give some minor advise liao...

09-11-2005, 09:50 PM	#8
mansiz Guest Posts: n/a	Welcome bro bentong. Yes bro, it's better to have a tank of at least 8mm. If it's 6mm, try not to lean too much live rocks on the side glasses. And bro, my advise to you is that, try not to go into reef if you intend to use a cooling fan, I tried it before, your corals will not survive long due to PO4 and NO3 from constant topping up of tap water, but if you have a water purified system for the tap water, then it's perfectly fine. Cooling fan evaporates a hug amount of water a day, a daily top up, or the most 2 days once a topping up of water is a must.

09-11-2005, 11:38 PM	#9
bentong Dragon Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 574	thks for all the advice.. im not sure how thick it is, standard ocean free 3ft tank.. shld be 6mm lah, cos it was only $35 ard 2 yrs back.. but my fren has been using the same tank in with marine setup for the same period(2yrs) and things hv been fine so far.. so im just hoping for the best, will try to minimise leaning the rocks on the side.. ok i shall invest in a gd skimmer, and guess wad, i managed to dig out an old eheim 1260, so i switch that with the pumps in my 6ft tank so i hv more options.. for a 4x2x2 using 70kg, i tink i would only need ard 20-25kg, if i dun pack it too tight.. becos if u calculate by tank volume, 3x1.5x1.5 is ard 182litres, 4x2x2 is 432litres, ard 2/5 only.. and yeah i shall fork out initially, then try and minimise spending.. as for the sugar, the theory i heard is this: during cycling, the main limiting factor is the amt of carbon the bb can obtain, not nitrogen or oxygen.. by adding sugar, we are providing extra carbon for it to use, so it can grow faster.. for example, if u were to add sugar to ur tank, there would be a bacteria bloom and the water would turn cloudy, in this case the limiting factors hv become the surface area for them to grow and oxygen, which can be increased by aeration.. so by providing maximum of every factor, can cultivate the bb faster.. or at least thats the theory, i shall try a bit tmr.. throw in prawns and sugar, and up aeration.. cant rmb hear from who one, tink its some aromedic in our forum.. without a fan, is it possible to go into corals? if i place my lights higher or wadever? yeah im moving fast, trying to settle everything asap, so it can be stable by the end of my hols.. btw, which place gd to buy lights? i dunno any places to buy marine stuff, went with my fren to reborn and paradiz reef today at boon keng area.. thks for all the help guys!

10-11-2005, 11:04 AM	#10
blueheaven Guest Posts: n/a	Do not add sugar to your system anytime in it's progress The bacterial population is very hard to control (2x every 20min) and when you get allelopathy happening due to Quorum Sensing, you are in big trouble Just add in the prawn and be patient.

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